So sad I almost memorized 18 random digits perfectly in less than 2 seconds

Memory Training Journals
44

It’s the underlying mechanism that allows for synesthesia that you are born with or rather, develop as a small child.

I was also a human calculator when I was a kid. Was I born with the knowledge of numbers or operations?No.

But my brain developed in such a way that allowed me to do large calculations in my head as soon as I came across numbers.

In my case it’s my memory, it’s excellent according to professionals.

It works the same for synesthesia.
Your brain developed the potential for synesthesia before you actually experience synesthesia.

A lot of synesthetes often have synesthesia in other areas too because the brain is often not specific or picky.

However the brain is often consistent. Once you experience synesthesia, you will always experience it, you can’t turn it off or “lower the volume”.

Because it’s about the way the brain is formed that allows for synesthesia this means that synesthesia can also be formed by brain damage and cases like these have been found.

Meet Jason Padgett.

https://youtu.be/7H6doOmS-eM

Unless fogelmemory had an accident that involved some brain damage or impact on the brain, I don’t think he has synesthesia.

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45

It’s the underlying mechanism that allows for synesthesia
Your brain developed the potential for synesthesia before you actually experience synesthesia

What is this mechanism or potential?
I have never heard of it before.

To my understanding synaesthesia is structural.
Structure changes in response to stimuli.
You seem to say potential for structure is born. Not easier, not harder, just definitely born.

But my brain developed in such a way that allowed me to do large calculations in my head as soon as I came across numbers.

Personal experience is great. This doesn’t prove that it is mechanism or potential.
That is because the critical period explanation would fit with your description too.
Many other explanations would too. The potential or mechanism explanation happens to fit. However, It is not the only explanation. There is no proof I am finding. Is that your opinion or is there a source?

46

Synesthesia has never been observed to be developed by adults. Like wikipedia says, it most likely develops during childhood.

There has never been an adult that created true synesthetic experience just from sheer trying. Only accidental origins have been observed.

Many studies have tried but it is never permanent.

However it is no suprise people here on the forum think otherwise. Not everything can be trained and obtained guys.

47

Synesthesia has never been observed to be developed by adults. Like wikipedia says, it most likely develops during childhood.

If it is difficult that is potentially the case.

From reading above, you said fogelmemory does not have it.
That is because it is not possible.

This is ignoring potential cases.
As you do not believe it is possible.

Your explanation tells me that you should believe it is possible for fogel.
That is because you said there is a “potential”.
This “potential” does not wane?
If it is not used right away, it does not vanish?
So anyone with this potential can acquire synaesthesia at any time?

However you say:

Many studies have tried but it is never permanent.

This does not make sense to me.
It tells me adults develop synaesthesia. Also that adults have difficulty keeping it.
So it tells me it is about keeping structure.
There are not many experiments on keeping structure.
It is a different problem.

By impossible do you perhaps mean unlikely?

48

From what I remember from the book, synesthesia in adults arises as a result of cultural requirements (language first and foremost) which make the brain maintain some ‘peculiar’ connections to manage the task which is learning of first language. Also, newborn children, having their connections in brain immature and less separated tend to have synesthesia much more often, they later grow out of it since the connections mature. It’s difficult to say to what degree newborn children have synesthesia since they dont know any language and synesthesia is hard to judge without knowing a language.

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50

No, I do think it is impossible to develop actual synesthesia as an adult. The impossible part is having a permanent result.

Studies have tried to mimick the experience by letting people for example read letter-colored books. The results often differ but even if the subjects experience some type of synesthetic experience, it is always short lived.

I do like the brain plasticity argument but it unfortunately doesn’t often hold because the thing with brain plasticity is that the brain is also inclined to go back to the way it was.

But this thread was about fogelmemory and his claim of having synesthetic experience.

We already know that a permanent result of synesthesia training has never been observed and that you either develop it as a child or get it through a brain damaging accident.

He didn’t mention having it in his youth and he didn’t say he was practising for synesthesia either.

However he did mention he had some mental illness in the past. I don’t know about the effects of it on the brain but that is the only way he perhaps could’ve developed synesthesia, on “accident” I guess.

He should see a professional if he wants to know for sure. It’s often very easy to test if your synesthetic experience is real by looking at the consistency and looking at your physical reactions during your synesthetic experience.

If I see multiple digits of the same number like 333 or 269993, I often feel uncomfortable and sometimes even cringe. It bothers me on a physical level. Those numbers are often harder for me to memorize but for other people those are the easiest.

While I am typing this, I am changing my mind about fogel’s synesthesia claim. It seems to really bother him which is a big sign of synesthesia.

4 years ago I had an autistic meltdown. My senses where overwhelmed and an ambulance and everything had to show up.

The trigger of my meltdown was actually my synesthesia.

I mentioned before how people with synesthesia often have synesthesia in multiple areas. I also have some synesthetic experience for random no-text images. This experience is often much intenser than my feelings for numbers. Stock photo’s and car commercials are the worst.

If fogel’s experience is that bothersome to him, I advice him to seek help. It can turn really bad.

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52

To reduce the chance of miscommunication, we should take into account the international nature of the forum. It’s difficult to describe cognitive processes, and even harder when translating into a foreign language.

I get the impression that synesthesia still isn’t well understood, but there is some evidence that synesthesia is more common in people with conditions like schizophrenia and autism.

Let’s move the discussion about whether synesthesia can be learned over to this thread though: Study: Synesthesia Can Be Learned — this thread can stay focused on sharing memorization scores. :slight_smile:

Thanks for the recommendation. I ordered a copy.

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Study: Synesthesia Can Be Learned
53

It doesn’t really matter what you do but you have to do something and that is the thing that seems unchangeable. Repetition in any way of form is required.

This makes it pretty difficult to maintain such a thing for a whole lifetime. At one point, you forget to train or your brain slows down because of age or you get sick, or you have to focus on something else that is going on in your life, etc.

There is also one aspect of synesthesia that can’t be obtained through training and that is the physical reaction your body can have on your synesthetic experience.

If I come across a random number I have never seen before and I like it then it can really make my day, lift up my mood, make me actually excited. Numbers describe things from a different perspective, like a 5th dimension.

The other way around too, seeing a number I don’t like can make me uncomfortable.

This part cannot be trained and it is also not easy to share. It’s very hard to describe such sensations to someone else because to them it’s just numbers.

But other than that synesthesia isn’t really that amazing in itself. I mentioned it before that there isn’t really a benefit other than perhaps another way to think creatively.

It’s like perfect pitch. A neat thing but not really practical.

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55

I have finally broken the 2.5s for memorizing 20 random digits in one line!

yes2-0
yes2-01422×640 37.6 KB

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56

gg really impressive

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57

Very nice score. :muscle::muscle:

Is this challenge we have to do only by 2 digit system??.

If not by 3 digit I can do it.
But by 2 digit system it’s harder for me.

My current best record : 1.5 sec => 20 digits. (However I didn’t did short memorization since many months now, currently mostly longer digits)
I guess I can improve little more in this.

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